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Re: recourse if our rules are violated?

On 2007-04-10 15:12, John C Klensin wrote: 

--On Tuesday, 10 April, 2007 09:30 +0200 Brian E Carpenter
<brc at zurich.ibm.com> wrote:

On 2007-04-10 01:27, Scott O. Bradner wrote:
Joel expressed my opinion before I got around to it 
Ditto. I think any procedure that amounted to the IETF
making, or appearing to make, a judgment of bad faith
would expose the IETF to a world of hurt.


Gentlemen, I agree, which is why I made the point as tentatively
as I did.  _However_ I suggest that this situation is not very
different from the ones we make about excluding people from
mailing lists.  To make that relationship more clear, take it as
given that it is impossible to reach a conclusion of bad faith
if someone created a late disclosure and claimed ignorance once.
How about if the same party does it a second time, possibly with
a slightly different excuse, with a different draft?   How about
the tenth time?  And, if the answer is "no, can't reach such a
conclusion", what is a PR-action about besides cutting someone
off who clearly and repeatedly is performing actions that
interfere with the successful progress of the standards process?


There is a difference, I think. In the case of disruptive postings,
the impact is completely internal to the IETF process. Everybody
learning to use the delete button would protect the standards process
just as well as a ban. In the case of possibly spurious IPR claims,
the impact could be external. If the IETF chooses to use the delete
button (i.e. ignore the claims), then every implementor must perform
due diligence, and be willing to go to court if they judge the claim
to be spurious.

I'm not sure what that leads to in terms of IETF procedures. We're
still left with two choices: ignore the IPR claim or ignore the
technology.

    Brian

    Brian

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